Masta Ace – The Unkut Interview

Having retired from solo projects, Master Ace was touring with his EMC crew when I caught up with him at the end of 2007. While he waited for his meal he held court at the hotel bar and gave me the chance to pick his brain on a number of topics, both relevant and trivial. His show later that night was also on point, as he went beyond the call of duty to keep the crowd entertained beyond the standard ‘pace around the stage’ bullshit.

Robbie: When you first came out, everyone used to think that ‘Action’ was your DJ, when it was really your crew.

Masta Ace: Oh yeah – Steady Pace.

That must have been frustrating.

For him it was – not as much for me. He just hated when people called him Action. It was confusing – I came up with the name ‘Ace & Action’ and people thought it was the DJ. Steady Pace is still around, man. He actually lives pretty close to me. We grew up together, and we both moved to New Jersey. Now we live pretty close to each other – and best friends – so he always laughs. We talk about that every now and then, so it’s pretty funny.

When you did your first video, wasn’t Biz meant to rock up but you had to make the puppet at the last minute?

What happened was, the original song was supposed to be a duet with me and Biz. Back then, Kane was writing a lotta Biz’s rhymes, so I basically was tryin’ to show Biz that I could write for him too. So I wrote the whole song with my verses and then when he heard the song – to figure out where his parts were gonna be – I changed my voice so he would know when he rhymed. So I recorded the whole song that way, with my verse and then me imitating him, so that he could learn his parts and understand the structure of the song. At that time he was having a little problem with Marley, he didn’t want to record at Marley’s house and everything – he was kinda mad at Marley at the time – Marley thought it would be a cool idea to just leave the song how it was, with me imitating Biz. So we left it that way, but when it came time to do the video the director came up with this cool idea for getting a puppet made, and the rest is history I guess.

You should get that puppet to fight the muppet from the UMC’s ‘Blue Cheese’ video. Biz would kick that dude’s ass!

Oh yeah [gives me unimpressed look].

With your first album, I gather you were involved in choosing the records – as far as bringing a record to Marley and saying, ‘Hook this up for me’?

In most cases with Marley, I would bring a sample from my mother’s record collection. I didn’t know how to produce as far as working the equipment – I knew kinda what I wanted it to sound like – but he knew how to work the equipment. So I would bring him a record, he’d listen to it – ‘Yo, this is hot’ – he would sample it, chop it up, add drums and all that stuff, then I would spit the rhymes. It was pretty much that way across the board with most of the artists on Cold Chillin’. Everybody contributed musically. I was the first artist on Cold Chillin’ to actually get co-production credit. Because all the projects that came out with Marley’s name on ’em, pretty much they were co-produced by the artist, but at that time they weren’t gettin’ the credit for it. That’s why a lot of ’em were mad at him – like Biz and other people. They felt like he was getting too much of the credit, when they were contributing a lot.

At the end of ‘Rolling Wit Umdada’ you’ve got your freestyle from Kane’s birthday party, when Big Ill The Mack ripped him.

It was a dope party. That was actually Grand Daddy IU that you heard at the end, sayin’, ‘Pick that mic up!’ That was a wild night. I have photos from that night, with all of us on stage rapping. Kane, Jay-Z, Nice & Smooth, Just-Ice, Positive K was in there, Ill from Ill & Al Skratch. What a night! At the time it was just a party – we was just doin’ what we do – but looking back on it, it’s like crazy! Just the amount of people and different artists that was up there rapping. Scoob Lover – there were mad people in there rhyming. It was a cool night though.

After Ill shit on Kane there must have been a bit of tension in the air though.

Oh you mean when Ill did that shit he did? Oh yeah, that was kinda crazy. Kane had already left – he wasn’t even by the stage when that happened. Really, most of the rappers that was up there, everybody had kinda dispersed. It was such a long cipher that it kinda got boring after a while, so everybody was kinda leaving, and Ill got up there and just started whylin’ – kinda goin’ at Kane – but only a few people was paying attention. I was one of the people that was paying attention, and I was like, ‘Well this guy’s kinda sayin’ some stuff about Kane at his own party’. It was tension after that night, where Kane’s DJ Mr. Cee was A&R at Mercury Records, and Ill & Al Skratch were signed to Mercury Records. They were actually scarred to come to the record label because they thought somebody was gonna do something to them. They were like worried, but everything got smoothed over.

Not to bring up bad blood, but how are things with Fat Joe now?

That’s mad old, that’s like ninety…I believe in settling things like men. I don’t believe in talkin’ stuff in magazines and radio stations – I go to the person and talk to them to their face. I knew that eventually we was gonna see each other, and we saw each other. We were face-to-face, he said how he felt, I said how I felt and that was pretty much the end. We shook hands afterwards! It could got heated and turned into something else, but it didn’t.

When you did the Sittin’ On Chrome album you received a lot of flack in the press – the same thing happened to Brand Nubian – about ‘pandering to the West’ and stuff like that.

That was a crazy backlash on me because I had such a successful record at the time. Being from New York and having a record that was getting played in the West Coast and Down South – at that time it was very much about what coast you were from and it was a lot of coastal pride goin’ on at that time – so I got a little backlash from that. That really was the beginning of the East Coast/West Coast beef that was already brewing, so the Sittin’ On Chrome album was really my way of trying to bridge the gap between East and West. So I had this whole scenario where my cousin from LA came too visit me in New York – cultural exchange – and we had a good time together even though he was very different than me. People were very upset with me about the record that I made. They thought I was trying to be a California rapper, where I really didn’t change my rhyme style at all – I just flipped a different beat, that really was a East Coast beat. But people at the time were so charged-up on East/West that they didn’t take the time to really listen to anything. They were just, ‘Oh, he’s down with them! He’s rockin’ with them!’ Whatever. I feel like I opened a lot of doors for New York artists to do other things musically. Now you see everybody making Down South music now – nobody’s getting yelled at or killed for it.

People still notice, though. Whatever happened to TJ Swan, man? Did you ever hear his album?

I heard it – it’s a great album! If that album woulda come out, he woulda been double platinum, household name. I don’t know what he woulda done from there, but this was a brilliant album. In that same spirit of the Biz Mark records – his singing style. The beats were hot! It was the beginning of that kinda New Jack Swing – hadn’t really takin’ off yet. A few of those TJ Swan tracks, Marley submitted to Bel Biv Devoe later. It was like on that cusp, yo, of that next R&B sound. If that record would come out? He woulda killed!

You’ve survived so many eras, and you’ve said that you don’t want to do any more solo albums. What point are you at now?

No more solo albums, but I still wanna rap. I still have some musical contributions that I wanna make. So the EMC project – I’m one of the artists on that project. I just wanna do something new and different. Me and Ed OG are working on a collaboration album – I wanna do projects that don’t have to be a ‘Masta Ace’ album, because I’m not tryin’ to compete with my solo albums.

So you don’t have that pressure?

Right. Everybody’s gonna measure it up to Disposable… or Long Hot Summer, but these records would be something different, so I won’t have to worry about that.

What is it about Brooklyn that sets you guys apart?

Brooklyn has a certain swagger – people from Brooklyn tell you how they feel. Of course I’m generalizing a little bit, but Brooklyn is that rugged spot. It’s got culture, it’s got vibe, it’s got danger. If you came-up in that atmosphere and you were able to survive and persevere, then you’re a better person for it as you go in your life. The experiences that I had in Brooklyn just have prepared me for life. Even to this day – I’m not in that atmosphere anymore – but if I get put into a situation where those instincts have to come out, they come out! If we step outside this building right now, and there’s some guys in the parking lot that’s thinking about doin’ something to us? I’m gonna know it before they even step to us! It’s just that instinct. I carry that with me all the time.

It must be a competitive environment as well, with so many people vying for top spot.

New York in general is just very competitive. Everybody drives fast, everybody’s tryin’ to cut each other off and get in front. Everybody’s knocking each other outta the way to get ahead. That’s New York – period.

You’ve done records with J-Love and that Marco Polo joint was a nice one. Are you gonna continue doing those one-offs?

Those kinda projects – I’m all for. I like doin’ those one-off things. It’s like a little small space in time where you can kinda redefine yourself or maybe just do something that you wouldn’t do on your own project. That’s what I get outta those records.

Were you nervous about the reaction to ‘Wake Me When I’m Dead’ with the Brand New Heavies, being that it was so different?

It was something different than what anybody had ever heard from me. That’s what kinda made me wanna do it and be excited about it. Just to experiment musically – try something that was a little bit outside of the box of what I’m known for. That was a classic album, Heavy Rhyme Experience, I’m glad I was a part of it. It really opened up the door for me to be to be a part of Delicious Vinyl records and do the two albums that I did with them.

Would you agree that you were one of the first people to put more of the vulnerable side of yourself on record?

I don’t know if I was one of the first. I believe other people have done that before me. I know that I did it in a time where all rappers seemed to be perfect – everybody was ‘the man’, ‘the don’, had the best car, the biggest jewelery, the best girl. I just did it at the time where it wasn’t fashionable to do it. I’m sure that there are artists that…Biz is like the perfect example of vulnerability when he was coming up. There’s plenty of people before me, but at the time I did it, it was odd to people. I think that’s why they appreciated it.

Is it true that you did a show at the NMS where you and your dancers were playing homeless dudes?

Yeah, the beginning of my show. That’s how we started the show off. We would dress-up like homeless bums, with trench coats and the hats tucked over our heads, and we did this whole dance routine. This goes back to 1989, 1990 when I started doin’ that routine. That was kinda the beginning of me just trying to be as creative as I could on-stage and entertain people.

I notice that Cold Chillin’ have been re-pressing your first album willy-nilly.

Yeah, we’re goin’ to court with that. I haven’t pulled the trigger yet, but we’re goin’ to court on that.

Finally, what’s up with Ice-U-Rock and them?

Those guys are good, man. Ice-U-Rock was Master Ice, Uneek and Rock Diesel – those were the three guys who made up Ice-U-Rock. I’m still friends with those guys. Rock is a reverend now, but Ice and Uneek – I still see those guys very often. Very recently we were doin’ this Playstation tournament…

Maddenbowl?

Yeah, we’ve been doin’ that since Sega Genesis – it’s been that long. I dropped out a couple of years ago when me daughter was born, but they kept doin’ it. They play every Saturday, I go by sometimes and hang out with those guys. Matter of fact – Ice, I just recently put him up on the Little Brother album – because we have similar taste in music, so every now and then I try to put them up on something they may not be aware of. He called me, tellin’ me that he really liked it. Those guys are good, man. They still do little stuff in the house, but they’ve accepted that music is not the route for them. They each work at schools and work with kids, and that’s the career path that they chose.

Master Ace feat. Ice-U-Rock – ‘Go Where I Send Thee’

Brand New Heavies feat. Masta Ace – ‘Wake Me When I’m Dead’

Masta Ace – ‘Rollin’ Wit Umdada’

Masta Ace – ‘Dear Diary’

Marco Polo feat. Masta Ace – ‘Nostalgia’

Masta Ace – ‘Me and the Biz’ video:

Masta Ace INC – ‘Slaughterhouse’ video:

Masta Ace INC – ‘Jeep Ass Nigga’ video:

Masta Ace INC – ‘Born To Roll’ video: